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Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by Serendipidy
4/9/2008  5:44:00 PM
Anonymous.Doesn't your paragraph four confirm most of what I have been saying all along. This is about the Curving Feather.
" In traditional CBM, you take two steps in the same direction". ( which is called Tracking ) " while turning the body ". ( Which would have been better called side of body ), " in the so called curved CBM " which of course becomes CBMP ". Do you beleive the feet guide the body or the body guides the feet ?. If it were the body you would go into a silly circle and the feet would not be tracking.
And your paragraph six seems to indicate you believe there are two ways of doing a Curved Feather. When in reality there is only one way if it is to be done correctly.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by anymouse
4/11/2008  7:59:00 AM
" in the so called curved CBM " which of course becomes CBMP ".

You are mistaken, curved CBM as utilized by dancers such as Jonathan & Melissa has nothing to do with CBMP. It doesn't even look remotely like it, because in curved CBM the body remains fairly square to the curving direction of travel meaning that the legs always seem forward-backward with respect to the body, instead of ending up across it in a way that could be mistaken for CBMP.

"you would go into a silly circle and the feet would not be tracking."

In curved CBM, the foot tracking such as it is, is that the feet track along a curved path rather than a straight one. I don't believe curved CBM is appropriate for general application, but there are places where you need to be able to generate a sense of foot tracking along a curved rather than a straight path. Some examples would be the man's right foot in a slip pivot, and also in a curved three step where you must brush your feet on a curved rather than straight path.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by Serendipidy
4/13/2008  2:46:00 AM
Anonymous. If I mistakenly try to produce a very tight turn on a Curving Feather Step will my second step become something that resembles a side step instead of a foot that is tracking the other one.
Which reminds me of something I read once That I am not even a bus, but I am a tram that travells on predestined tracks once that first step is taken.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by anymouse
4/14/2008  8:29:00 AM
"Anonymous. If I mistakenly try to produce a very tight turn on a Curving Feather Step will my second step become something that resembles a side step instead of a foot that is tracking the other one."

If you let that happen, yes. But you can also learn to create a sense of tracking along a curved, rather than straight path. This works best when rise is incoporated to aid in the curving of the path.

"Which reminds me of something I read once That I am not even a bus, but I am a tram that travells on predestined tracks once that first step is taken."

Yes and no. You have inertia to continue in that direction, and so most figures will see you go that way. However you can also add a push in a new direction. So for example in a quarter turn, you push sideways from the first step, with the result that an original movement DW becomes a movement along the LOD - you change the direction of travel by 45 degrees.

Similarly, you can do this as a curved movement. But you must create a sense of connection between the steps. Straight lines are the most logical form of connection, but not the only option on the table.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by Serendipidy
4/14/2008  2:18:00 PM
Anonymous. Your 4th paragraph is the very thing that needs to be understood.When you say You push sideways from the first step.
You are speaking from the man's perspective only.
For the lady there is that little description which says NFR on step one.
The push will come later than the man's.In laymans terms Let him pass first. Do not try to arrive at exactly the same time.
Follow , do not lead.
A word from the wise. The Mother of Perfection is Repartition.
The Curving Feather. The first two steps are about as straight as is possible. Question. According to the latest book is there Sway on any of the three steps.I don't have the latest manuel
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by anymouse
4/14/2008  2:34:00 PM
"Anonymous. Your 4th paragraph is the very thing that needs to be understood.When you say You push sideways from the first step.
You are speaking from the man's perspective only.
For the lady there is that little description which says NFR on step one.
The push will come later than the man's."

No, the trajectory of the bodies must match, so the lady will push sideways to partially redirect her movement at the same time that the man does. If she did not, then she'd be dancing a 3/8 natural turn rather than matching his desire to dance a quarter turn.

This is a separate issue from the delayed completion practiced by the person on the inside of the turn.

"In laymans terms Let him pass first. Do not try to arrive at exactly the same time."

In the 90 degree turn figure being discussed, he isn't going to pass her nearly as much as he would in the 135 degree natural turn, so this difference is going to be smaller than it would be in a natural turn.

Note however that I never said she would arrive at the same time - what I said was that she had to push sideways in order to make a change in her body trajectory that matches the change in his. She can still arrive later, but she must make a matching change.

Probably the simplest way to understand this is to turn the figure around and have the man dance the inside action while leading. He's got to lead the sideways change in her trajectory by pushing sideways from his feet, while also letting his partner get there first.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by Serendipidy
4/14/2008  3:01:00 PM
Anonymous. The man does the inside action on the Progresive Chasse. There is no need to turn the figure around. Also the ladies position on the man's right side will not alter. In todays dancing it is all about you go I go. The ladies position in relation to the man is well to his right side which allows this to happen. You go I go shows up more in the V. Waltz where it is important to understand within a partnership no two people will swing at the same time. The Swing is reserved for the person who is going forward.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by anymouse
4/14/2008  3:11:00 PM
"The Swing is reserved for the person who is going forward."

This is only relatively true, not completely true. The person on the inside of the turn will swing, just not as much.

And the difference in the partner's swings is substantially smaller for the more sideways swing of the quarter turn than it is for the pass-your-partner swing of the 3/8 turning natural.

Think about it this way: the less turn there is made, the less difference there is in the distance to be traveled by the outside partner vs. the inside one.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by Serendipidy
4/14/2008  11:03:00 PM
Anonymous. A normal Quarter Turn starts facing diag to wall . If you follow the Quarter Turn to the Right with a Progressive Chasse you will finish facing diagonal to the wall. Hold that line for the Lock Step which is normally commenced and finished facing diagonal to the wall.
If you are using a Heel Pull for the man to finish facing diag to the centre. I think that would be a 1/2 turn wouldn't it.
What is most important for the person on the outside of the turn is that they will be on two toes as the left foot is placed to the side which is why the footwork on the first step is down as H.T. and the person on the inside of the turns footwork is not down as T.H.T.
The Heel Pull is so old- fashioned I think the only time it would be used is if it is to be followed by a Chasse Reverse Turn.
Re: To Torque or not to Torque
Posted by anymouse
4/15/2008  6:39:00 AM
Serendipity, what exactly is your point?

You type in a bunch of well known trivia, completely unrelated to the subject at hand and in no way backing up your mistaken argument.

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